Dried mealies?

Vicki on November 9th 2011, 6:53 pm

Hi all

Roughly, how many dried mealies are ok to feed a hog in one day?

As I got him he'd be raised on dried, I was told a large pinch was fine and this is what I'd given him. Since finding out he's massively fussy with food we've moved on to live mealies so we can gut load them to get some goodness inside him!

However, I just got him a treat ball and aim to fill it with mealies so he rolls it around and gets a treat.

I was just going to fill it and then let him loose with it but felt this may be a bad idea if there is some kind of limit of the number of dried meal worms they're allowed in one sitting.

pat1101 on November 9th 2011, 7:01 pm

Hi

When I was researching the same topic, the advice I was given was no more then 5 dried meal worms a day, due to their high fat content., but as many live mealworms as you like. It will be interesting watching this thread to see if peoples thoughts have changed in the last 2 years.

Hope that helps

Vicki on November 9th 2011, 7:10 pm

It would be nice to know a guide as I've not seen it written anywhere.

My hog wont touch anything else other than meal worms and his dried cat food.

I've tried him on chicken,mince,egg,veg and fruit and as of yet he's turned his nose up at everything.

I've always had his dried cat food out, placed a pinch of dried mealies in each night and that's that. Now he has his cat food and about 20 live mealies each night.

The dried ones now are just being used as a treat when he's out and about but a guide to how many i can put in his treat ball each night would be good!

pat1101 on November 9th 2011, 7:33 pm

If you personal message Rachel (enola 69) on here she is a fountain of knowledge.

Kiania on November 10th 2011, 1:25 am

Dried, no more than 3. There is a massive concern in the US at least regarding compaction in hogs due to dried mealworms (and the lack of the enzyme that breaks down the chitin, that is lost in the drying process).

Live, well, I was recommended about 20. I use them in my treat ball. I occasionally find one that has escaped during cleaning, but in a ZZ2 (or viv), that isn't going to happen (mine usually hide under the lowest bar of my pen).

Hogs are insectivores, they kinda need insects. I'm not entirely sure about the reliance on meat (carnivore-based diet) that is suggested. It makes a good base (mince and kibble), but insects are definitely heavily needed.

Did you consider roaches? Dubias are as easy to keep (apparently as easy to breed, but they have a longer cycle), and far healthier. Less fat, and a better meat-to-chitin ratio. If you PM me your email address, I can mail out my live food guide, but it won't be for a couple of weeks as I'm on holiday atm.

Victoria_hearts_Rocky on November 10th 2011, 10:21 am

I was told 4-5 max and preferably not every day. When Rocky was on meds he had a pinch of mealies with the antibiotics mixed in which was the vet's instructions because he had stopped eating, and the dried mealies kick started his appetite again. There are some reports of them causing issues but these all seem to be linked to one horror story article on the internet. Like our junk food, they are fine in moderation.

**angriesthedgehog** on November 10th 2011, 11:14 am

I generally just prefer live as they can be gut loaded and all my hogs just seem to prefer them. With live I feed 4-5 per day depending on the hedgehog (tubby hogs will get less, runner hogs who can loose weight will get more). With dried I tend to use them in treat balls, kongs or sometimes a scatter in a playpen to keep them interested. I dont give every night (personal choice really) but maybe about 20 in a week

Kiania - do you have any links to an article or something regarding compaction in hedgehogs? I would like to read Smile

Jamiioo on November 10th 2011, 12:22 pm

Victoria_hearts_Rocky wrote:I was told 4-5 max and preferably not every day. When Rocky was on meds he had a pinch of mealies with the antibiotics mixed in which was the vet's instructions because he had stopped eating, and the dried mealies kick started his appetite again. There are some reports of them causing issues but these all seem to be linked to one horror story article on the internet. Like our junk food, they are fine in moderation.

I have to agree with this. Despite all the Americans advising against it i too have only ever found one reported case, and that is out of the whole of the USA who have owned hogs for how long? I used to feed dried all the time to Munchie 5/6 per day or more and he would be fine, lots of other people feed dried with no problems.

As someone else said (cant remember who would need to source thread) Saying dried might be harmful to your hog and therefore recommending against feeding them is a bit like saying don't use pouches because there have been 2 cases of hogs in the UK dying due to use of pouches.

I do like the crisp comparison though lol. And i do agree, live are alot better for your hogs. I have had my beetles for 2 months now and there are still no signs of hatchling mealies eh?!

Also, i feed 4/5 mealies per night also as one of my hogs are prone to weight issues. Not sure about the free feeding live mealies thing, as i have now read that 2 reccommended breeders have said too free feed live? So not sure? However if i think if i done this with Munchie he would have balooned into a football like state in no time, lol!

Kiania on November 11th 2011, 2:03 am

angriesthedgehog wrote:Kiania - do you have any links to an article or something regarding compaction in hedgehogs? I would like to read

I'm on a netbook, so not to hand. If you want to do exactly what I would do, head over to HHC and type in compaction, or even dried mealworms, into their search box. That or wait a couple of weeks, and I'll be home again, and so able to do the search myself.

As for live, if you have a hog that is prone to weight issues, they are what you limit (roaches might be better, purely for the fat content). I'd never advocate giving too many to anything but a hog that has a large cage, or one that is an excessive runner hog. But for those that can self regulate, well, hogs are insectivores, offering more insects cannot be bad thing, both for nutrition and enrichment. And live is especially great for hogs that aren't fond of fruit and veg (my hog, for example!).

**emdools** on November 11th 2011, 7:30 am

Jamiioo wrote:I do like the crisp comparison though lol. And i do agree, live are alot better for your hogs. I have had my beetles for 2 months now and there are still no signs of hatchling mealies

Have you had a russle through the substrate? The mealies will be tiny!

Vicki on November 11th 2011, 3:04 pm

With 4-5 a day being the general consensus I guess I'll stick with this.

I may try live ones in his treat ball - he only has that when he's out in his play pen so I can keep an eye on any escapes!

I may try him on other live foods then - he's only ever had mealies (both with me and the breeder) but there's no harm in trying. He's only just getting to the weight/age I've seen recommended for wheel use so I'm yet to discover if he's going to be a runner or not!

I've got a good independent reptile shop just down the road from me so I think convenience would come above benefits of cost and I'd just buy rather than attempting to breed!

I'd highly recommend them for anyone living in the Hatfield/Potters Bar etc area - they do me a tub of live mealies for £2 which when kept with some oats and a bit of carrot etc thrown in once a week last me 2 weeks when feeding about 20 a night!

In saying that I'm off to my parents for the weekend and the hog's coming with me - as of yet undecided on weather or not to try and bring live mealies on what will be a relatively warm car trip!

Kiania on November 11th 2011, 7:18 pm

Tiggy only feeds live mealworms, but Bodhi took to roaches like she was born to it Smile

She also has eaten locusts, but seems to prefer roaches (mealworms are her favourite, but variety is good!). I'd be offering them early on, as it does seem like hogs get stuck in their ways. I think Bodhi had locusts and roaches at week 9 onwards. Week 8 was a little hectic as I wasn't living at home, so mealworms were the best I could do.

Definitely try dubias. Discoids are also fairly good, but are a little more spendy. I go for medium sized nymphs, but she can take out roaches bigger than her head, she just doesn't like the adult males because of the wings.

I buy 500g of mealworms at a time from Rick, although I'm breeding, I don't have the turn over right just yet to be entirely independant, but they get mixed in with the bought ones, so she's had a few of the good ol' home grown variety too now. Think 500g was about £5 or something...but it'd be easier for anyone else to check via googling. I hate netbooks and their limitations for window opening :(

karen on November 12th 2011, 11:53 am

From hedgehog central

http://hedgehogcentral.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2163&p=17390&hilit=compaction#p17390

http://hedgehogcentral.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5633&p=45889&hilit=compaction#p45889

My personal views are everything in moderation, dont get too hung up I mean from a human perspective how boring would life be if we never ate chocolate, crisps, sugar etc, its all about a balanced diet follow that with your hedgehogs & you cant go wrong.

Jamiioo on November 14th 2011, 12:28 am

emdools wrote:
Jamiioo wrote:I do like the crisp comparison though lol. And i do agree, live are alot better for your hogs. I have had my beetles for 2 months now and there are still no signs of hatchling mealies

Have you had a russle through the substrate? The mealies will be tiny!

OMFG! Had a russle and close look and i has lots of bubba' worms! YAY! elmo

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